Steve Lukather is one of the most well respected, well known, and admired guitarists in the history of rock music. He is best known for his work as the lead guitarist and co-lead singer for the highly successful classic rock band Toto; but he has also had a very extensive and highly successful solo career, and has done guest work on more albums than he could even think of; including contributing songwriting duties to one of the most successful albums in music history: Michael Jackson’s Thriller. For the first time in almost 10 years the band Toto has gotten together to create a masterful new studio record with all new material. With the help of returning members lead singer Joseph Williams, Keyboardist Steve Porcaro, and new drummer Keith Carlock, Toto has been reborn in a sense, and have composed one of the strongest records of their entire catalogue. Metal Exiles had the privilege to speak to the legendary guitarist to discuss the creation of the new record, the upcoming world tour in support of Toto XIV, as well as what the future holds for the iconic rock band known as Toto.
An interview with Steve Lukather
By Michael Knowles
Metal Exiles: It wasn’t that many years ago when the band had called it quits, you were basically the only remaining original songwriter and fans kinda had to come to grips with the fact that Toto was no more.
Steve: I mean it was a long time ago; it almost killed me to be quite honest with you.
Metal Exiles: Fast forward a few years and you guys release a live DVD that does incredibly well charting number 1 in countries around the world, now you are set to release an album that’s garnering critical acclaim from just about everyone. Would you mind sort of describing the journey to get to this point of releasing an album for the first time in almost a decade?
Steve: The only thing that brought us back together was the reality that we were trying to help a brother, you know. What motivated us, and what was going to be one tour in 2010…we had so much fun and the response was so overwhelming and so positive, so we thought we could do it again the next year for the same reason. I mean we all have bills to pay, we help ourselves, we help Mike and everybody wins, and the fans were digging what we were doing. And it was the 35th Anniversary we thought we’d do a DVD. And when we decided to do it all of sudden we have law suits thrown at us that the manager had signed a piece of paper that if we do anything at all we have to deliver a brand new studio album. And we were like what the fuck? That was very strange and as it turned out we fought it for a second then all of sudden our lawyers were like look, just make the fucking album, you’ll make some money, you’ll fucking have a new product, you know that was just a whole different commitment to make to make a brand new album. You know your time of life…we hadn’t made an album in 10 years, then we started writing you know and we were like this is not just a summer tour for fun this is like jumping back on. And we had to have a serious conversation about that which we did. And we were like if we’re going to do this we have to do something…we have to do a personal best for ourselves and A prove that the album is not dead beat, B prove that old guys still do have new ideas and you know we didn’t want to throw some piece of shit out there because of a contractual obligation and shit on the fans and friends we’ve made over the past 40 years. So it was a big responsibility to deliver, so we spent a great deal of time and money for this record. 10 months of our lives, and blood, and sweat, laughter, tears, arguments, and all the shit you go through, like a bunch of fucking old married men you know. And you know we’ve known each other since we were 15 years old, so I mean there’s a lot of history and a lot of expectations…you know it’s hard to impress people that have heard you play your whole life so everybody had to bring their very best as far as songwriters, musicians, vocal performances, production ideas you know. I mean we’re all very strong personalities so to get back in a room together we had to bring in…well we didn’t have to but I asked to bring my friend and co- producer CJ Vanston because I figured we needed somebody to keep us focused, and keep us from killing each other. So as great of friends as we are, it’s like sitting six bulls in a room with one cow to fuck. There are a whole lot of people who want to get their licks in if you know what I mean. So at the end of the day when we argue about things, we laughed and hugged and went home. But you know sometimes that tension brings better music out, it makes you do things differently. You’ll get mad and maybe play something you wouldn’t have played because you were like…oh yea you don’t like that then try this mother fucker. And something good comes and you go, see I told you, and they go fuck you and we all laugh, and we hug, and we go ok something good came from it.
Metal Exiles Some tracks on the new record have a really classic Toto feel like the intro track Running out of Time and Chinatown as well.
Steve: Well actually the thing with Chinatown is I found that song from 1977 which David had forgotten he had it, and I was like dude you have to finish this piece of music the old fans will love this. I mean that’s very much an update from 1977, just revamped so I thought that would be kick, our original bass player Dave Hungate came back and played on it, so it really does have a feel from that particular era, a little nod back to our beginnings, that song was actually written before Toto even existed
Metal Exiles: Was that a conscious decision to really tailor to longtime fans?
Steve: No… we wanted to make a record that we liked, I mean you have to sit down with a piece of art no matter what it is, and at the end of the day you have to be proud of it yourself. We didn’t want to reinvent the wheel in other words, try to do something stylistically left turn. The band is what it is and it’s the first time Steve Porcaro, Joseph Williams, David Paich and I had been in a recording studio together making new music since the 80’s. So sticking us in a room together…well of course we’ve been friends for all this time, we’ve done a few things, but writing and making new music from scratch, that was a whole new experience, because we are all different people then we were 27 years ago or so. So I mean we had very high expectations for ourselves, we put a lot of pressure on ourselves to deliver the right music, but we weren’t trying to you know write…or we didn’t have any pressure to write a hit single because what the fuck is that anyway? What are we going to compete with fucking Kanye are you kidding me? I mean that’s laughable and you know we’ve always fallen in the cracks we’re too Jazz for rock, we’re too rock for Jazz, not heavy enough to be considered a serious rock band, and way too heavy to be a pop band so I mean you know we’re Prog, we’re pop, we’re R&B, we have all these weird influences that we don’t even talk about, that’s just what happens when you shove us in a room because we all have such different musical taste. And when you put it all together it makes this big musical gumbo called Toto you know for lack of a better adjective. I mean we don’t sit around, it’s not that pre meditated, it’s just when we start playing together that’s the sound that comes out.
Metal Exiles: Would you mind describing the overall writing process for the band, is it just one big melting pot of ideas?
Steve: Yea a lot of times a lot of these things, everybody has pieces, like “Great Expectations,” that was a lot of people bringing in a lot of different pieces, and we were like how do we make this work. And that was like us going way back into Yes mode, Yes is one of our favorite bands from when we were kids. You know Close To The Edge, reoccurring themes where like a melody comes back with a different twist to it in a different part of the song, and lots of different sections, mood changes, you know that piece “Great Expectations” has all our favorite prog band influences like Yes, Genesis, Jethro Tull and Pink Floyd. All that shit that we just thought we’d have fun with, and pay a little homage to our heroes. I mean we did that a lot because we’re still music fans, I mean it’s hard we keep forgetting that we’re not 17 anymore. I mean if I just avoid mirrors I’m fine. I mean we still have a passion of young guys, when we get in there we get excited, when we start working together a little spark happens you know, and when we started recording and the first couple things started falling into place we started going, we may have something here man, this might be fun. And then we got excited about it and then everybody started really digging it and taking it seriously and the end result is 10 months later what you hear right now.
Metal Exiles: Toto is such a unique rock band in that pretty much every member is a lead singer, how do you decide who takes the reins on the lyrics, or is it usually a collaborative effort?
Steve: Most times we just try it, usually there’s a recording desk and then there’s a big window and then there’s a microphone out there. And the first time we were working at CJ’s place in his studio and we all had headphones on and there’s a microphone, a great little room and sometimes we go you know let me try this line, or you know I’m hearing this let me try this. And we’d do it just by sitting there together sometimes various combinations of us would sing the same song. There’s not a lot of rock bands that have 3 lead singers on the same song. But lyrically it worked because they’re not love songs, with the exception of 1 or 2, that were sung by other people. What I’m saying I mean we just threw the rule book out and said well this sounds good f— it we’ll make it work. And sometimes if somebody felt strongly about saying something we said yea try it, and sometimes I said you know it’s not you man I think I could do this better. Then I’d try it and everyone would go yea man you’re right. Or we’d go Dave you have to sing this, and he’d go I don’t want to sing this, and we’d go no you have to. And we have to have a Steve Porcaro song on the record, stuff like that; I mean there are things we all felt very strongly about so we did it.
Metal Exiles: One of the major stand out tracks for me was the song “Burn,” how did that song formulate?
Steve: Well that was early on, that was a piece that Dave and Joe started working on, like towards the end of our last tour when we started saying you know what man we might have to start making a record, we need to get some ideas together and Joseph had that little beginning piano line and he played it for Dave and then they did a little demo version up at Dave’s studio which a lot of their little demo’s ended up sounding completely different than the original idea, which happens a lot of the time. I just thought it was a really interesting thing. The chorus killed me, but I said we’ve got to make it bigger. So the difference between how it starts and how big that chorus is was really something we strived for you know, so it was like a big surprise. You think oh ok this is a nice little song, where’s this going then all of a sudden boom it smashes the fence.
Metal Exiles: Yea it starts out almost like a ballad, then that chorus just hits you in the face
Steve: Yea the first couple songs on the album you either get people’s attention or you don’t, and the element of surprise is missing so much in music now, I mean my god you can almost…I can shout out the chorus before it happens now on the first listen. I mean the lyrics are just really…I mean they used to give us s— about lyrics and in many cases they were right but jesus…some of the stuff I hear right now it’s so bad I just laugh, I go wow I mean if we wrote that 25/30 years ago they would have beaten us to death for it.
ME: The song 21st Century Blues really reminds me of a track that we would see on one of your solo albums, I immediately thought of your album Candyman or even your last album Transition when I heard it.
Steve: Yeah I wrote it with CJ you know who co-produced and co-wrote the last couple records of mine, It’s a little nod to Steely Dan, a band I really love, we’ve all been big Steely Dan fans, in high school that’s all we played. Jeff Porcaro was in Steely Dan when we were in high school so there’s a deep connection between that band and us. And we’ve always really dug where they’re coming from harmonically and groove wise so that’s kind of without talking about it much, just kind of how it worked out with us. But that song lyrically is about every time you wake up in the morning there’s like never any good news anymore and I wanted to write something that had a riffy blues thing, and I also wanted to write something that really had some interesting chord changes to play over because I’m really just tired of the same old thing. I want to play arpeggios instead of a one chord blazing solo you know. I wanted to be more, you know nobody plays shit like this because that’s what separates me from all those other players, because obviously there’s a million guys that shred way better, and faster, and cooler than me but I mean that’s not my strongest point, my strongest point is harmonically strangely placed notes and phrasing. I mean you have to write interesting chord changes in order to pull that off, so I mean your average rock player would be lost playing those chord changes, because there’s a lot of plus 11th chords stuff you just can’t play the blues through. So you got to know where you’re going, the theory that makes sense, what the common tones are between all these chord changes. Sounds a little like there’s some harmony and theory involved and at that point I sort of patterned after one of my favorite Larry Carlton solos like Kid Charlemagne on the Royal Scam album, I mean here you got this guy playing B Bops through a rock sound, I mean Carlton is my hero, one of my old teachers and dear friends, I just got off the road with him 3 weeks ago we were in Japan making a new DVD so that will be coming out soon which is fun. And you know we’re having a good time with it and I just wanted to write some harmonically interesting things and that’s what the whole band wanted to do. We didn’t want to write the same stupid dumb chord changes.
Metal Exiles: What also stands out right away with this album is just how great frontman Joseph Williams sounds.
Steve: I mean he’s the MVP for me man he’s like finding an old Les Paul under the bed that you forgot about. You know he wasn’t on the road singing our songs and squeaking up his voice he was scoring for television and film, he’s a real musician like us. And so when it came time to do it he had this fresh new voice that hadn’t been all fucked up. I mean he lives a clean life and has for 20 some odd years so you know whatever burn happened at the end of the 80’s, which we were all a little toasted, I mean when you’re a lead singer you can’t really do that shit but we’re all adults now, I mean I’m 57 years old man. Yea you know I was crazy when I was young like everybody else but he was an undiscovered gem when we brought him back in. He had this voice, this pristine voice like this is fucking great! He started taking lessons and got in shape, I mean he really took the gig seriously and he’s such a great musician, he’s such a great friend and I’m so happy for him to bring it like this it’s just so fucking cool, it’s really amazing.
Metal Exiles: It’s as if this guy has discovered the fountain of youth it’s really unbelievable, he hasn’t lost anything in the last 25 years.
Steve: If anything I think he’s stronger now to be honest with you because he knows how to sing now and he knows his limitations, he knows how to live on the road, and we’re writing songs in keys so he can sing it. A lot of the guys back in the era that we all started at, wrote stuff in the wrong key and they all had to live with that and they destroyed their voices doing it. So I mean it wasn’t their fault it was just the time you know?
Metal Exiles: Another returning member on the album is Steve Porcaro, I know he’s contributed in some capacity on the previous albums, but what is it like to have him back as a full on writing partner?
Steve: Well to have him back in the band period was incredible. I wanted it that way I mean I wanted to look around at my old high school friends and go yea man this is where the band…I mean to have his sound, the dueling keyboard thing, that was what set us apart you know and I really think that the things he does to the record are a value, an integral part of the band. Plus he has such a great vibe on stage and our friendship, I mean we’ve been brothers since we were 15 years old. I don’t have that many friends like that.
Metal Exiles: There’s a new drummer in the band Mr. Keith Carlock, replacing the great Simon Philips, definitely some big shoes to fill.
Steve: Yea but Simon wanted to do his own thing and I can’t begrudge him for that. I mean we’re still very close friends, I love and think the world of Simon. He gave us 20 plus years of insanely great playing and writing and focus and dedication. And at a certain point he wanted to do things his own way, I mean he was in The Who after Keith Moon, he was in our band after Jeff Porcaro. I mean when he started booking things at the same time as us, finally he had to make a decision whether it was us or you know he wanted to do things his way. You know it’s not out of the realm of possibility that we’ll work together again, of course I’d love to work with Simon again but for right now we changed directions and I thought Keith Carlock was the right call to do something completely different. Just like I thought Simon didn’t play like Jeff, Keith doesn’t play like Simon. It harkens back to an older groove oriented thing instead of a fusion oriented thing. But Simon could play all sorts of stuff. People didn’t like Simon at first, so you know with our band you make changes and some people are going to get all tweaked out but at some point you have to say get over it man. It is what is I can’t bring back Jeff and Mike Porcaro man, Mike is in a bed. ALS is a terrible disease, if you know anything about it at all, it’s brutality, it’s the worst prison you could ever be in. And so we’re doing our best to support our bro and Jeff is gone so this is us in 2015 doing the best version of our band that we could possibly do.
Metal Exiles: Over the years you guys have self-produced the majority of your albums, why the decision to go with a guy like CJ Vanston?
Steve: Well I knew that we needed somebody in there to help keep us focused and help keep the ball running, and we didn’t want to be in the studio 12 hours a day anymore. We needed somebody who’s a great engineer who is a great musician, great producer, someone we all felt comfortable with, somebody we respect, and someone to keep us from killing each other. Someone to tell us go home I got this, you’re past it now. We needed that third ear; I don’t think the album could have been made without him I think he was an integral part of what was going on.
Metal Exiles: Seeing how well this album has been received and as much as it has been built up deservingly so, it may lead fans to sort of wonder if this is the swan song album.
Steve: Well I said that last time and it probably was and you know judging by the way the record business is at this point, if you’re going to ask me if we’re going to make an album in 10 years, will there be records in 10 years? I mean I don’t know. If this is our last album I can say…I can be real proud of that. I can’t predict the future anymore because when I do I’m always wrong. I can say I don’t see that in my future (laughs) I can tell you that, I think this one was like ok, well talk to me in 10 years and we’ll see.
Metal Exiles: Well you’d definitely be going out on a high not that’s for sure.
Steve: Well I hope so, ask me a year from now and I’ll tell you then.
Metal Exiles: The band is set to embark on an extensive European tour towards the end of May, what are some of the venues you are especially excited to play?
Steve: Well we’re doing Sweden Rock which is like 45 thousand people and we’re on right before Def Leppard which is second on the bill which is really a great sweet spot to be in, there are a million bands doing that. We sold out the Ziggo Dome in Amsterdam which is like 11 thousand people, now they just made it bigger for us. So we’re four months in advance we’re selling out gigs all over the place so we’re really excited about that, there’s like 5 or 6 shows already sold out, the albums not even out, we haven’t even started doing press work yet, we’re just starting now. So I mean the last DVD Live in Poland was #1 all over the world so all of a sudden we have new buzz on us. We’re baffled and really happy and that’s going on, we don’t know how or why but you don’t ask questions when things are going well. I’m just going like wow! This doesn’t happen. Something keeps bringing us back together to work. Lord knows the entire planet has tried to kill us, I mean in some cases they succeeded. But I mean we were done then we weren’t done. Something keeps bringing us back so obviously we’re not finished yet so we’re looking at this as a whole new lease on life I mean jesus christ here we are at our age to get this shot again, we’re very grateful and kind of like how the fuck did this happen, but I’m not going to say anything, don’t tell anyone.
Metal Exiles: Can fans look forward to possibly another DVD recording in the support of the album?
Steve- Ask me on our 40th Anniversary man, once again after going through all that shit with the litigation and craziness involved. Let’s just get this album out, tour for a couple years and see how it goes. Beyond that I’m out on the road with Ringo right now having a blast, that’s always fun and you know I’m working on this project obviously and we’re going to go on the road and see how it goes, so far so good. I’m really excited about it, it’s going to be a great couple of years ahead. That’s assuming the world doesn’t go to fucking hell, that can happen at any moment anyway.
Metal Exiles: I know you’re doing one U.S. show in April, but any plans to do an extensive North American tour?
Steve: Oh we’re going to be out a lot in the U.S. in August/ September but right now we’re doing one warm up show, well it’s not even a warm up show we’re doing a private show and then we thought well we’re already here, we’ll do one show. It pays for all the startup costs for a really big tour, Mark Brickman’s doing our lights, you know he did The Wall, he’s done Pink Floyd, he did all the Gabriel stuff, he did the Bruce Springsteen shows, he’s like one of the biggest lighting guru’s there is, biggest bad ass and he’s an old friend of ours from the Boz Scagg’s days back in the 70’s and he’s going to design a show for us, we’re kind of excited about bringing that out you know. So you’ll see us in August/September and there’s a big surprise coming with who we’re going on the road with, it’s going to be a lot of fun I can’t say anything now I’ll have to kill you but you’ll know in a few weeks, you’ll go ahh that mother fucker, that's cool. It’s not the obvious shit at all, we want to avoid the obvious at all costs, which is why we haven’t gone on any of those tours that you would think we would go be on a bill with so and so and so and so some of our piers but we just purposely avoided that because we just didn’t feel that we really fit in. I mean I love all those guys they’re all my friends but we just said nah no no it doesn’t feel right, or the business wasn’t right or whatever you know. Something kept us from that this time it’s different. So we’re making a little bit of noise in the U.S. again which is really…makes me feel good we’re playing good venues, people are showing up. The band is in great form; we’re playing better than ever so hopefully everyone will come out and see us on this.
I’d like to dedicate this interview to the late Mike Porcaro, who passed away a couple days ago after a long battle with ALS also known as Lou Gehrig’s disease. Mike has been the longtime bass player for Toto, and as a die-hard fan myself I felt it was important to say just how much I’ve appreciated his one of a kind talent and the sheer exuberance he played with. I know I speak for all Toto fans when I say that he will be sincerely missed, and his legacy as a one of a kind iconic bass player I know will live on forever. Whoever pops in a Toto record can’t help but notice Mike’s truly definitive sound, and he has truly made a mark on not only the music world but also the hearts of fans all over the world. Mike you will be missed.
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An interview with Steve Lukather
By Michael Knowles
Metal Exiles: It wasn’t that many years ago when the band had called it quits, you were basically the only remaining original songwriter and fans kinda had to come to grips with the fact that Toto was no more.
Steve: I mean it was a long time ago; it almost killed me to be quite honest with you.
Metal Exiles: Fast forward a few years and you guys release a live DVD that does incredibly well charting number 1 in countries around the world, now you are set to release an album that’s garnering critical acclaim from just about everyone. Would you mind sort of describing the journey to get to this point of releasing an album for the first time in almost a decade?
Steve: The only thing that brought us back together was the reality that we were trying to help a brother, you know. What motivated us, and what was going to be one tour in 2010…we had so much fun and the response was so overwhelming and so positive, so we thought we could do it again the next year for the same reason. I mean we all have bills to pay, we help ourselves, we help Mike and everybody wins, and the fans were digging what we were doing. And it was the 35th Anniversary we thought we’d do a DVD. And when we decided to do it all of sudden we have law suits thrown at us that the manager had signed a piece of paper that if we do anything at all we have to deliver a brand new studio album. And we were like what the fuck? That was very strange and as it turned out we fought it for a second then all of sudden our lawyers were like look, just make the fucking album, you’ll make some money, you’ll fucking have a new product, you know that was just a whole different commitment to make to make a brand new album. You know your time of life…we hadn’t made an album in 10 years, then we started writing you know and we were like this is not just a summer tour for fun this is like jumping back on. And we had to have a serious conversation about that which we did. And we were like if we’re going to do this we have to do something…we have to do a personal best for ourselves and A prove that the album is not dead beat, B prove that old guys still do have new ideas and you know we didn’t want to throw some piece of shit out there because of a contractual obligation and shit on the fans and friends we’ve made over the past 40 years. So it was a big responsibility to deliver, so we spent a great deal of time and money for this record. 10 months of our lives, and blood, and sweat, laughter, tears, arguments, and all the shit you go through, like a bunch of fucking old married men you know. And you know we’ve known each other since we were 15 years old, so I mean there’s a lot of history and a lot of expectations…you know it’s hard to impress people that have heard you play your whole life so everybody had to bring their very best as far as songwriters, musicians, vocal performances, production ideas you know. I mean we’re all very strong personalities so to get back in a room together we had to bring in…well we didn’t have to but I asked to bring my friend and co- producer CJ Vanston because I figured we needed somebody to keep us focused, and keep us from killing each other. So as great of friends as we are, it’s like sitting six bulls in a room with one cow to fuck. There are a whole lot of people who want to get their licks in if you know what I mean. So at the end of the day when we argue about things, we laughed and hugged and went home. But you know sometimes that tension brings better music out, it makes you do things differently. You’ll get mad and maybe play something you wouldn’t have played because you were like…oh yea you don’t like that then try this mother fucker. And something good comes and you go, see I told you, and they go fuck you and we all laugh, and we hug, and we go ok something good came from it.
Metal Exiles Some tracks on the new record have a really classic Toto feel like the intro track Running out of Time and Chinatown as well.
Steve: Well actually the thing with Chinatown is I found that song from 1977 which David had forgotten he had it, and I was like dude you have to finish this piece of music the old fans will love this. I mean that’s very much an update from 1977, just revamped so I thought that would be kick, our original bass player Dave Hungate came back and played on it, so it really does have a feel from that particular era, a little nod back to our beginnings, that song was actually written before Toto even existed
Metal Exiles: Was that a conscious decision to really tailor to longtime fans?
Steve: No… we wanted to make a record that we liked, I mean you have to sit down with a piece of art no matter what it is, and at the end of the day you have to be proud of it yourself. We didn’t want to reinvent the wheel in other words, try to do something stylistically left turn. The band is what it is and it’s the first time Steve Porcaro, Joseph Williams, David Paich and I had been in a recording studio together making new music since the 80’s. So sticking us in a room together…well of course we’ve been friends for all this time, we’ve done a few things, but writing and making new music from scratch, that was a whole new experience, because we are all different people then we were 27 years ago or so. So I mean we had very high expectations for ourselves, we put a lot of pressure on ourselves to deliver the right music, but we weren’t trying to you know write…or we didn’t have any pressure to write a hit single because what the fuck is that anyway? What are we going to compete with fucking Kanye are you kidding me? I mean that’s laughable and you know we’ve always fallen in the cracks we’re too Jazz for rock, we’re too rock for Jazz, not heavy enough to be considered a serious rock band, and way too heavy to be a pop band so I mean you know we’re Prog, we’re pop, we’re R&B, we have all these weird influences that we don’t even talk about, that’s just what happens when you shove us in a room because we all have such different musical taste. And when you put it all together it makes this big musical gumbo called Toto you know for lack of a better adjective. I mean we don’t sit around, it’s not that pre meditated, it’s just when we start playing together that’s the sound that comes out.
Metal Exiles: Would you mind describing the overall writing process for the band, is it just one big melting pot of ideas?
Steve: Yea a lot of times a lot of these things, everybody has pieces, like “Great Expectations,” that was a lot of people bringing in a lot of different pieces, and we were like how do we make this work. And that was like us going way back into Yes mode, Yes is one of our favorite bands from when we were kids. You know Close To The Edge, reoccurring themes where like a melody comes back with a different twist to it in a different part of the song, and lots of different sections, mood changes, you know that piece “Great Expectations” has all our favorite prog band influences like Yes, Genesis, Jethro Tull and Pink Floyd. All that shit that we just thought we’d have fun with, and pay a little homage to our heroes. I mean we did that a lot because we’re still music fans, I mean it’s hard we keep forgetting that we’re not 17 anymore. I mean if I just avoid mirrors I’m fine. I mean we still have a passion of young guys, when we get in there we get excited, when we start working together a little spark happens you know, and when we started recording and the first couple things started falling into place we started going, we may have something here man, this might be fun. And then we got excited about it and then everybody started really digging it and taking it seriously and the end result is 10 months later what you hear right now.
Metal Exiles: Toto is such a unique rock band in that pretty much every member is a lead singer, how do you decide who takes the reins on the lyrics, or is it usually a collaborative effort?
Steve: Most times we just try it, usually there’s a recording desk and then there’s a big window and then there’s a microphone out there. And the first time we were working at CJ’s place in his studio and we all had headphones on and there’s a microphone, a great little room and sometimes we go you know let me try this line, or you know I’m hearing this let me try this. And we’d do it just by sitting there together sometimes various combinations of us would sing the same song. There’s not a lot of rock bands that have 3 lead singers on the same song. But lyrically it worked because they’re not love songs, with the exception of 1 or 2, that were sung by other people. What I’m saying I mean we just threw the rule book out and said well this sounds good f— it we’ll make it work. And sometimes if somebody felt strongly about saying something we said yea try it, and sometimes I said you know it’s not you man I think I could do this better. Then I’d try it and everyone would go yea man you’re right. Or we’d go Dave you have to sing this, and he’d go I don’t want to sing this, and we’d go no you have to. And we have to have a Steve Porcaro song on the record, stuff like that; I mean there are things we all felt very strongly about so we did it.
Metal Exiles: One of the major stand out tracks for me was the song “Burn,” how did that song formulate?
Steve: Well that was early on, that was a piece that Dave and Joe started working on, like towards the end of our last tour when we started saying you know what man we might have to start making a record, we need to get some ideas together and Joseph had that little beginning piano line and he played it for Dave and then they did a little demo version up at Dave’s studio which a lot of their little demo’s ended up sounding completely different than the original idea, which happens a lot of the time. I just thought it was a really interesting thing. The chorus killed me, but I said we’ve got to make it bigger. So the difference between how it starts and how big that chorus is was really something we strived for you know, so it was like a big surprise. You think oh ok this is a nice little song, where’s this going then all of a sudden boom it smashes the fence.
Metal Exiles: Yea it starts out almost like a ballad, then that chorus just hits you in the face
Steve: Yea the first couple songs on the album you either get people’s attention or you don’t, and the element of surprise is missing so much in music now, I mean my god you can almost…I can shout out the chorus before it happens now on the first listen. I mean the lyrics are just really…I mean they used to give us s— about lyrics and in many cases they were right but jesus…some of the stuff I hear right now it’s so bad I just laugh, I go wow I mean if we wrote that 25/30 years ago they would have beaten us to death for it.
ME: The song 21st Century Blues really reminds me of a track that we would see on one of your solo albums, I immediately thought of your album Candyman or even your last album Transition when I heard it.
Steve: Yeah I wrote it with CJ you know who co-produced and co-wrote the last couple records of mine, It’s a little nod to Steely Dan, a band I really love, we’ve all been big Steely Dan fans, in high school that’s all we played. Jeff Porcaro was in Steely Dan when we were in high school so there’s a deep connection between that band and us. And we’ve always really dug where they’re coming from harmonically and groove wise so that’s kind of without talking about it much, just kind of how it worked out with us. But that song lyrically is about every time you wake up in the morning there’s like never any good news anymore and I wanted to write something that had a riffy blues thing, and I also wanted to write something that really had some interesting chord changes to play over because I’m really just tired of the same old thing. I want to play arpeggios instead of a one chord blazing solo you know. I wanted to be more, you know nobody plays shit like this because that’s what separates me from all those other players, because obviously there’s a million guys that shred way better, and faster, and cooler than me but I mean that’s not my strongest point, my strongest point is harmonically strangely placed notes and phrasing. I mean you have to write interesting chord changes in order to pull that off, so I mean your average rock player would be lost playing those chord changes, because there’s a lot of plus 11th chords stuff you just can’t play the blues through. So you got to know where you’re going, the theory that makes sense, what the common tones are between all these chord changes. Sounds a little like there’s some harmony and theory involved and at that point I sort of patterned after one of my favorite Larry Carlton solos like Kid Charlemagne on the Royal Scam album, I mean here you got this guy playing B Bops through a rock sound, I mean Carlton is my hero, one of my old teachers and dear friends, I just got off the road with him 3 weeks ago we were in Japan making a new DVD so that will be coming out soon which is fun. And you know we’re having a good time with it and I just wanted to write some harmonically interesting things and that’s what the whole band wanted to do. We didn’t want to write the same stupid dumb chord changes.
Metal Exiles: What also stands out right away with this album is just how great frontman Joseph Williams sounds.
Steve: I mean he’s the MVP for me man he’s like finding an old Les Paul under the bed that you forgot about. You know he wasn’t on the road singing our songs and squeaking up his voice he was scoring for television and film, he’s a real musician like us. And so when it came time to do it he had this fresh new voice that hadn’t been all fucked up. I mean he lives a clean life and has for 20 some odd years so you know whatever burn happened at the end of the 80’s, which we were all a little toasted, I mean when you’re a lead singer you can’t really do that shit but we’re all adults now, I mean I’m 57 years old man. Yea you know I was crazy when I was young like everybody else but he was an undiscovered gem when we brought him back in. He had this voice, this pristine voice like this is fucking great! He started taking lessons and got in shape, I mean he really took the gig seriously and he’s such a great musician, he’s such a great friend and I’m so happy for him to bring it like this it’s just so fucking cool, it’s really amazing.
Metal Exiles: It’s as if this guy has discovered the fountain of youth it’s really unbelievable, he hasn’t lost anything in the last 25 years.
Steve: If anything I think he’s stronger now to be honest with you because he knows how to sing now and he knows his limitations, he knows how to live on the road, and we’re writing songs in keys so he can sing it. A lot of the guys back in the era that we all started at, wrote stuff in the wrong key and they all had to live with that and they destroyed their voices doing it. So I mean it wasn’t their fault it was just the time you know?
Metal Exiles: Another returning member on the album is Steve Porcaro, I know he’s contributed in some capacity on the previous albums, but what is it like to have him back as a full on writing partner?
Steve: Well to have him back in the band period was incredible. I wanted it that way I mean I wanted to look around at my old high school friends and go yea man this is where the band…I mean to have his sound, the dueling keyboard thing, that was what set us apart you know and I really think that the things he does to the record are a value, an integral part of the band. Plus he has such a great vibe on stage and our friendship, I mean we’ve been brothers since we were 15 years old. I don’t have that many friends like that.
Metal Exiles: There’s a new drummer in the band Mr. Keith Carlock, replacing the great Simon Philips, definitely some big shoes to fill.
Steve: Yea but Simon wanted to do his own thing and I can’t begrudge him for that. I mean we’re still very close friends, I love and think the world of Simon. He gave us 20 plus years of insanely great playing and writing and focus and dedication. And at a certain point he wanted to do things his own way, I mean he was in The Who after Keith Moon, he was in our band after Jeff Porcaro. I mean when he started booking things at the same time as us, finally he had to make a decision whether it was us or you know he wanted to do things his way. You know it’s not out of the realm of possibility that we’ll work together again, of course I’d love to work with Simon again but for right now we changed directions and I thought Keith Carlock was the right call to do something completely different. Just like I thought Simon didn’t play like Jeff, Keith doesn’t play like Simon. It harkens back to an older groove oriented thing instead of a fusion oriented thing. But Simon could play all sorts of stuff. People didn’t like Simon at first, so you know with our band you make changes and some people are going to get all tweaked out but at some point you have to say get over it man. It is what is I can’t bring back Jeff and Mike Porcaro man, Mike is in a bed. ALS is a terrible disease, if you know anything about it at all, it’s brutality, it’s the worst prison you could ever be in. And so we’re doing our best to support our bro and Jeff is gone so this is us in 2015 doing the best version of our band that we could possibly do.
Metal Exiles: Over the years you guys have self-produced the majority of your albums, why the decision to go with a guy like CJ Vanston?
Steve: Well I knew that we needed somebody in there to help keep us focused and help keep the ball running, and we didn’t want to be in the studio 12 hours a day anymore. We needed somebody who’s a great engineer who is a great musician, great producer, someone we all felt comfortable with, somebody we respect, and someone to keep us from killing each other. Someone to tell us go home I got this, you’re past it now. We needed that third ear; I don’t think the album could have been made without him I think he was an integral part of what was going on.
Metal Exiles: Seeing how well this album has been received and as much as it has been built up deservingly so, it may lead fans to sort of wonder if this is the swan song album.
Steve: Well I said that last time and it probably was and you know judging by the way the record business is at this point, if you’re going to ask me if we’re going to make an album in 10 years, will there be records in 10 years? I mean I don’t know. If this is our last album I can say…I can be real proud of that. I can’t predict the future anymore because when I do I’m always wrong. I can say I don’t see that in my future (laughs) I can tell you that, I think this one was like ok, well talk to me in 10 years and we’ll see.
Metal Exiles: Well you’d definitely be going out on a high not that’s for sure.
Steve: Well I hope so, ask me a year from now and I’ll tell you then.
Metal Exiles: The band is set to embark on an extensive European tour towards the end of May, what are some of the venues you are especially excited to play?
Steve: Well we’re doing Sweden Rock which is like 45 thousand people and we’re on right before Def Leppard which is second on the bill which is really a great sweet spot to be in, there are a million bands doing that. We sold out the Ziggo Dome in Amsterdam which is like 11 thousand people, now they just made it bigger for us. So we’re four months in advance we’re selling out gigs all over the place so we’re really excited about that, there’s like 5 or 6 shows already sold out, the albums not even out, we haven’t even started doing press work yet, we’re just starting now. So I mean the last DVD Live in Poland was #1 all over the world so all of a sudden we have new buzz on us. We’re baffled and really happy and that’s going on, we don’t know how or why but you don’t ask questions when things are going well. I’m just going like wow! This doesn’t happen. Something keeps bringing us back together to work. Lord knows the entire planet has tried to kill us, I mean in some cases they succeeded. But I mean we were done then we weren’t done. Something keeps bringing us back so obviously we’re not finished yet so we’re looking at this as a whole new lease on life I mean jesus christ here we are at our age to get this shot again, we’re very grateful and kind of like how the fuck did this happen, but I’m not going to say anything, don’t tell anyone.
Metal Exiles: Can fans look forward to possibly another DVD recording in the support of the album?
Steve- Ask me on our 40th Anniversary man, once again after going through all that shit with the litigation and craziness involved. Let’s just get this album out, tour for a couple years and see how it goes. Beyond that I’m out on the road with Ringo right now having a blast, that’s always fun and you know I’m working on this project obviously and we’re going to go on the road and see how it goes, so far so good. I’m really excited about it, it’s going to be a great couple of years ahead. That’s assuming the world doesn’t go to fucking hell, that can happen at any moment anyway.
Metal Exiles: I know you’re doing one U.S. show in April, but any plans to do an extensive North American tour?
Steve: Oh we’re going to be out a lot in the U.S. in August/ September but right now we’re doing one warm up show, well it’s not even a warm up show we’re doing a private show and then we thought well we’re already here, we’ll do one show. It pays for all the startup costs for a really big tour, Mark Brickman’s doing our lights, you know he did The Wall, he’s done Pink Floyd, he did all the Gabriel stuff, he did the Bruce Springsteen shows, he’s like one of the biggest lighting guru’s there is, biggest bad ass and he’s an old friend of ours from the Boz Scagg’s days back in the 70’s and he’s going to design a show for us, we’re kind of excited about bringing that out you know. So you’ll see us in August/September and there’s a big surprise coming with who we’re going on the road with, it’s going to be a lot of fun I can’t say anything now I’ll have to kill you but you’ll know in a few weeks, you’ll go ahh that mother fucker, that's cool. It’s not the obvious shit at all, we want to avoid the obvious at all costs, which is why we haven’t gone on any of those tours that you would think we would go be on a bill with so and so and so and so some of our piers but we just purposely avoided that because we just didn’t feel that we really fit in. I mean I love all those guys they’re all my friends but we just said nah no no it doesn’t feel right, or the business wasn’t right or whatever you know. Something kept us from that this time it’s different. So we’re making a little bit of noise in the U.S. again which is really…makes me feel good we’re playing good venues, people are showing up. The band is in great form; we’re playing better than ever so hopefully everyone will come out and see us on this.
I’d like to dedicate this interview to the late Mike Porcaro, who passed away a couple days ago after a long battle with ALS also known as Lou Gehrig’s disease. Mike has been the longtime bass player for Toto, and as a die-hard fan myself I felt it was important to say just how much I’ve appreciated his one of a kind talent and the sheer exuberance he played with. I know I speak for all Toto fans when I say that he will be sincerely missed, and his legacy as a one of a kind iconic bass player I know will live on forever. Whoever pops in a Toto record can’t help but notice Mike’s truly definitive sound, and he has truly made a mark on not only the music world but also the hearts of fans all over the world. Mike you will be missed.
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